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Quitting methadone with sub taper

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  • #31
    Thanks a lot. I'm pretty much betting the farm that is the case. Any way you look at it, coming off two months of sub has to be better than 2+ years of done. After today, I'd almost consider trying a half or three quarters tomorrow. But the plan says 4 days, so I dunno what the general consensus would be. I may just take half, then keep the other two quarters on me in case I need one or both of them. Or maybe take 3/4, and keep the other 1/4 on hand. That actually sounds more like what you suggested. We'll see how things go. Thanks again for all the advice.

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    • #32
      Randy35, It's funny you mention the dosing as I was just thinking about this today and wanted to ask someone. I've been dosing once per day, so far I tried both and haven't noticed a difference so I decided on once per day to avoid cutting issues while really low. Why do you suggest once per day? I have heard this before but wondered why. Is it just to help get out of the habit of taking meds certain times of day? I have heard the before but wondered if that is the only reason.

      I am curious because I noticed especially at low doses some people need to dose 2 or even more times per day. Just this morning i thought what if it is bad as in maybe other peoples bodies are eliminating it quicker than mine, and I could possibly have a longer road because of that? I really have no clue, it's just a nervous thought that occurred to me today. Hopefully I'm totally off base here!

      Sorry mrjones for getting a little off topic on your thread. I'm glad things went well with your transition to sub!!
      Last edited by Anonymous; 08-21-2014, 12:44 AM.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by MrJones View Post
        Thanks a lot. I'm pretty much betting the farm that is the case. Any way you look at it, coming off two months of sub has to be better than 2+ years of done. After today, I'd almost consider trying a half or three quarters tomorrow. But the plan says 4 days, so I dunno what the general consensus would be. I may just take half, then keep the other two quarters on me in case I need one or both of them. Or maybe take 3/4, and keep the other 1/4 on hand. That actually sounds more like what you suggested. We'll see how things go. Thanks again for all the advice.
        Try not to reduce TOO much when beginning the taper. I have read where others have reduced their dose too much, felt lousy and had some tough symptoms, then felt the need to take an additional dose to compensate for it. Then you feel defeated by doing that. Know what I mean. You want to keep reducing slowly and steady for optimal results.

        If you follow Robert's taper plan it calls for a 25% reduction in dose every 4 or so days. If you followed those directions a 25% reduction from 1mg would be a dose of .75mg.

        I've said it here before that I began reducing by .25mg increments once I was down to a dose of 2mg. I was on a high dose of 8mg inducting from methadone. I went from 2mg to 1.75 to 1.50 and so on until I was down to a dose of .125mg and then jumped. But it turns out a 25% reduction from 1mg is the same as I was doing - .75mg. I honestly believe you should follow the plan and make your reductions 25%. If you reduce the 1mg by HALF that would be a dose of .50mg and probably too much of a drop the first time. Again, it's all up to you of course. I only suggest.

        Glad to hear you're doing well.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by hopesoon View Post
          Randy35, It's funny you mention the dosing as I was just thinking about this today and wanted to ask someone. I've been dosing once per day, so far I tried both and haven't noticed a difference so I decided on once per day to avoid cutting issues while really low. Why do you suggest once per day? I have heard this before but wondered why. Is it just to help get out of the habit of taking meds certain times of day? I have heard the before but wondered if that is the only reason.

          I am curious because I noticed especially at low doses some people need to dose 2 or even more times per day. Just this morning i thought what if it is bad as in maybe other peoples bodies are eliminating it quicker than mine, and I could possibly have a longer road because of that? I really have no clue, it's just a nervous thought that occurred to me today. Hopefully I'm totally off base here!

          Sorry mrjones for getting a little off topic on your thread. I'm glad things went well with your transition to sub!!
          My answer is based on my own experience, and what I have read on this forum in many, many threads and posts. With that said I would suggest you dose once per day for 2 main reasons - The half life of subs is usually believed to be from 24 hours (minimum) to as long as 72 hours in most people. Therefore a single one-time dose in the morning would surely last until the following morning, 24 hours later. It's so much a "mental" thing where we addicts usually took our drug of choice more than once per day - and usually several times a day. Don't need to do that with subs, but we feel the "need" to dose more than once based on our past experiences.

          Get away from addictive behavior and dose only once. And yes, you should also take your subs at the same time everyday. Get in the habit of taking it in the morning and go about your day with work or whatever you usually do. You will find the sub will last until the following day, the half life will make sure of it.

          Thanks for your question and best wishes to you!

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          • #35
            Randy, thanks for your advice. I reached the same conclusion, so I dosed at 0.75 today and I feel great. I've been catching up on some overdue household chores all morning. I see exactly what you're saying about dropping too fast, but if I'm looking for the lowest effective dose, I am still probably above that even at 0.75. Regardless, I'll stay here for the 4 days to begin my taper then. Thanks again for everything; I'll write again later this afternoon.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by MrJones View Post
              Randy, thanks for your advice. I reached the same conclusion, so I dosed at 0.75 today and I feel great. I've been catching up on some overdue household chores all morning. I see exactly what you're saying about dropping too fast, but if I'm looking for the lowest effective dose, I am still probably above that even at 0.75. Regardless, I'll stay here for the 4 days to begin my taper then. Thanks again for everything; I'll write again later this afternoon.
              Hey there. Good to see your induction went well. I'm pretty surprised you were able to stabilize at 1 mg and are now taking .75 mg. Don't get me wrong, it's a good thing. But usually we see people needing a bit more at first. Don't get into a rush. Make absolutely certain that you're stable before every drop. Stay at each dose for at least 4 full days. Reducing before becoming stable will likely cause problems throughout your whole taper.

              You're doing great. Keep it up!

              All the best,
              Kat

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              • #37
                Absolutely. The last thing I need to do is mess this up. Its funny you mentioned not getting in a rush, cus I just realized that I was counting down days and everything already. Just a little anxious I guess. This has to work, as I'm sure you know. How are things going for you? Did you jump?!

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                • #38
                  LOL.. dont be worried about counting the days.. I counted down to minutes! that's kinda a good thing... your getting excited!
                  happy day to you!
                  Melinda

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by MrJones View Post
                    Absolutely. The last thing I need to do is mess this up. Its funny you mentioned not getting in a rush, cus I just realized that I was counting down days and everything already. Just a little anxious I guess. This has to work, as I'm sure you know. How are things going for you? Did you jump?!
                    Yep, slow and steady is the way to go with a Sub taper. Don't worry, all will be well as long as you follow the plan.

                    Yes, I jumped! Today is my "Day 1"! I'm so excited to finally be done...can't quite put it into words. I'm having symptoms but they're not horrible.

                    Have a good night,
                    Kat

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by melindau View Post
                      LOL.. dont be worried about counting the days.. I counted down to minutes! that's kinda a good thing... your getting excited!
                      happy day to you!
                      Melinda
                      I know! I just wish I could be done with this. I expect things will not be too bad until its jump time; then I'll be pulling every card I can. I need to go ahead and set up a doc that will give me some meds to help with symptoms once I jump and all. The plan makes it sound like its smooth sailing after you ween yourself down, but I seriously doubt its going to be easy. But yeah, I am totally excited. I haven't been this optimistic in a long time. Thanks, and a good day to you too.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by MrJones View Post
                        I know! I just wish I could be done with this. I expect things will not be too bad until its jump time; then I'll be pulling every card I can. I need to go ahead and set up a doc that will give me some meds to help with symptoms once I jump and all. The plan makes it sound like its smooth sailing after you ween yourself down, but I seriously doubt its going to be easy. But yeah, I am totally excited. I haven't been this optimistic in a long time. Thanks, and a good day to you too.
                        You shouldn't have too much worry as far as symptoms are concerned when you make your final jump. It's usually those that have been on sub for long periods of time and very high doses that seem to have the most trouble.

                        I was inducted on 8mg and remained on sub for about 9 months. I had a few bumps in the road for a little over a week after my jump and that was about it. Nothing horrible, just more annoying than anything. You on the other hand inducted on the extremely small dose of 1mg and you're already tapering. I would expect you to have a much easier time than I did. It varies of course person to person, but don't expect things to be that severe. Remain positive and that will help.

                        The doctor could give you some Clonodine which is a blood pressure med that's used off label to combat detox symptoms. Lots of doctors will prescribe this med if they know their patient is getting off drugs. You could get a sleep aid, but please be overy cautious with that if you do ask for it. Maybe just a few days worth and then let things get back to normal on their own.

                        No matter what you get there's gonna be some time that needs to pass before things begin to improve.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by MrJones View Post
                          I know! I just wish I could be done with this. I expect things will not be too bad until its jump time; then I'll be pulling every card I can. I need to go ahead and set up a doc that will give me some meds to help with symptoms once I jump and all. The plan makes it sound like its smooth sailing after you ween yourself down, but I seriously doubt its going to be easy. But yeah, I am totally excited. I haven't been this optimistic in a long time. Thanks, and a good day to you too.
                          Hey there. Most people who have followed Robert's taper plan say that the jump is much easier than they expected. The anxiety and anticipation make us think the worst. Read the end of Alex's thread. Sharks Fan and Lincolnecho, too. All of them were on Sub only a few months and had very minimal symptoms after jumping. If you were a long time Sub user it would be more difficult at the end. Have faith!

                          As far as comfort meds to help with the jump, a lot of docs will give Clonidine, Gabapentin, a non-narcotic muscle relaxer, etc. But lots of people have jumped without any of those meds and were just fine.

                          Hope you have a good day.
                          Kat

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Iwantoff2013 View Post
                            Yep, slow and steady is the way to go with a Sub taper. Don't worry, all will be well as long as you follow the plan.

                            Yes, I jumped! Today is my "Day 1"! I'm so excited to finally be done...can't quite put it into words. I'm having symptoms but they're not horrible.

                            Have a good night,
                            Kat
                            Awesome!!! I really hope today goes well for you. I mentioned it earlier in the thread, but coming off of pills a few years ago was much easier than I thought because I left town for a couple of weeks. I'd say the thought of withdrawals crossed my mind only about once per day, and it never really bothered me; although I did have some "herbal" relaxation assistance. I have no doubt that this will be nowhere near as easy; going through dt's for only three days this week from methadone showed me how bad it could be. But I do think that there is something to be said for mind over matter. I wish you the best for day 2.

                            I stuck with 0.75 today. 2 more days there, then I'll try my first decrease. I feel like >>>> when I wake up, and dose immediately, but it still takes around 30 min to feel better. I'd always heard it only took around 10 min, but oh well. But anyway, I feel great at this dose. It may be just a little more than what I would like, but I'm here now, so I'll stay the course and try dropping 25% on Monday.

                            Congrats on your jump. Good luck. Btw, are you taking any meds to reduce symptoms?

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Randy35 View Post
                              You shouldn't have too much worry as far as symptoms are concerned when you make your final jump. It's usually those that have been on sub for long periods of time and very high doses that seem to have the most trouble.

                              I was inducted on 8mg and remained on sub for about 9 months. I had a few bumps in the road for a little over a week after my jump and that was about it. Nothing horrible, just more annoying than anything. You on the other hand inducted on the extremely small dose of 1mg and you're already tapering. I would expect you to have a much easier time than I did. It varies of course person to person, but don't expect things to be that severe. Remain positive and that will help.

                              The doctor could give you some Clonodine which is a blood pressure med that's used off label to combat detox symptoms. Lots of doctors will prescribe this med if they know their patient is getting off drugs. You could get a sleep aid, but please be overy cautious with that if you do ask for it. Maybe just a few days worth and then let things get back to normal on their own.

                              No matter what you get there's gonna be some time that needs to pass before things begin to improve.
                              I so hope you're right about the final jump. I suppose I'm a little lucky that I was on meth instead of sub for all that time. Speaking of which, today makes seven days since my last dose of methadone and I'm still feeling great at .75. I got someone else to start the plan today; time will tell if they're taking it as serious as they should though.

                              I start my first reduction day after tomorrow. As time goes on and I get closer to jumping, I'll find a good doctor to help me out, but I may try some otc stuff for things like sleep aids and others. Thank you all and I wish all of you the best.

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                              • #45
                                I've been meaning to update my thread for quite a while, but haven't gotten around to it. I can't believe that over a month has passed, and I'm very near the end of my taper. Honestly, until just a few days ago, I hadn't had ANY adverse symptoms coming from tapering. I've tried to stick to the plan like clockwork, but there were a few times, when I was sick with a sinus infection and subsequent ear and throat infection, that I didn't realize I was taking twice what I was supposed to. I thought to myself, "this looks bigger than normal...Did they start making them bigger or something?" Then, after about three days, I had my aha moment and had to taper more just to get back to where I was before. I guess when it was 6am and my mind was all foggy from the illness I just wasn't thinking right.

                                Anyway, I'm down to 0.15 mg now, and will drop again tomorrow. Hopefully tomorrow I'll be seeing the doc to get meds to help with withdrawals. This past Saturday I waited a few hours to dose, just to see how I felt; it wasn't as bad as I thought it was going to be. I so hope jumping will be bearable.

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